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Last modified: January 12, 2005


Outlands College of Heralds

From the office of the Rampart Herald
Lady Alia Marie de Blois
rampart@outlandsheralds.org

Line Emblazon Sheet
Color Emblazon Sheet
November 2004 Letter of Presentation
December 2004 Letter of Response
December 2004 Letter of Intent
April 2005 LoAR Results
Return to the Rampart home page.

The following items were sent to Laurel for a final determination:

  1. Ashi'al Külüjin. Resubmission - Kingdom Device. Gyronny vert and argent, a horse rampant Or within a bordure counterchanged.
    Submitted as a bordure "gyronny argent and vert", it should be reasonable to blazon it as "counterchanged".
  2. Boleslav Ragnarsson. New Primary Name and New Device. Per chevron checky sable and argent and sable, a chevron Or and in base a fox head couped argent.
  3. Caerthe, Barony of. New Order Name. Order of the Sojourners of Evan Mawr.
    While I am not completely convinced that this is registrable (according to Project Ordensnamen, all order names including the pattern 'Name' use the names of saints, Jesus, or God), I am sending it to Laurel, to establish a precedent for these types of names.
  4. Elisant le Chevaler. New Primary Name.(SEE RETURNS FOR DEVICE)
  5. Elyenora Danyel de La Roche. New Primary Name.
  6. Halla in heppna Kn{o,}rsdóttìr. Resubmission - Laurel Device. Purpure, in fess three straight trumpets Or.
    As this submission has passed Kingdom, I have notified Laurel that she wishes to withdraw her current device submission (on the August LoI), Argent, a serpent nowed purpure and (on the October LoP), Paly purpure and argent.
  7. Halla in heppna Kn{o,}rsdóttìr. Resubmission - Laurel Badge. (Fieldless) A pair of barnacles inverted purpure surmounted by a straight trumpet Or.
    As this submission has passed Kingdom, I have notified Laurel that she wishes to withdraw her current badge submission (on the August LoI), (Fieldless) a serpent nowed purpure.
  8. Ian Lindsay Macrae. Resubmission - Laurel Device. Gyronny sable and argent, a wyvern erect gules winged Or maintaining a sheaf of arrows inverted and a bow Or within a bordure gules.
    As the legs are hanging down, not up, the wyvern was reblazoned as "passant".
  9. Kristana Tancz. Resubmission - Kingdom Device. Purpure, on a chevron between three crescents Or, a spider sable.
    As "two and one" is the default arrangement for three charges around a chevron, this can safely be dropped from the blazon.
  10. Rowland McCain. New Primary Name.
    While the documentation submitted does not directly contain the spelling McCain as submitted, it contains several similar spellings, which cover all the parts of the McCain spelling. Particularly, Cain is dated to 1586, and McKane is dated to 1408.
  11. Stefnir Kolfiđarson. New Primary Name.
    Originally passed by Rampart on the October Letter of Response, this item was inadvertently left off the October Letter of Intent. It does appear on the December Letter of Intent.
  12. Theresa Yolanda Cabeza de Vaca. New Device. Argent, two chevronels braced and on a chief rayonny sable three diamond-cut gemstones argent.
    Although no documentation was sent for this particular cut of gemstones, I was able to find the previously send documentation in the file.
    This particular cut of gemstone is documented using Gems and Jewels: Uncut Stones and Objets d'Art by Henri-Jean Schubnel (english translation from French, Library of Congress Catalog Card Number 74-167718). In the text on page 5, it also says "About 1380 a true cutting technique was practised in France: a large flat face (the table) was made by cutting across one of the apexes of the octahedron; then the 'ribs' of this table and those on the back of the stone were cut to give eight supplimentary facets". On page 4-5, the illustrations are captioned "The development of the brilliant cut for diamonds. Left to right: the original 'eight cut' introduced during the fourteenth century ...". The emblazon shows an outline nearly identical to the 'side view' given for the 'eight cut'.
  13. Ulrik Halvarson. Resubmission - Kingdom Device. Per pale Or and azure, a reremouse counterchanged.

The following items are returned for further work:

  1. Astrid Halfdansdottir of Lothian. New Primary Name and New Device. Sable, a domestic cat rampant guardant Or maintaining in its dexter paw a Norse Sun Cross, a bordure embattled argent.
    This name suffers from multiple issues. In a capsule summary, ancestry.com is not a suitable source of documentation for SCA names; according to several Old Norse sources, the first two parts of this name would be Ástríđr and Hálfdanardóttir (or Astriđr and Halfdanardottir, without the accents); Lothian is only documentable as the modern name of the area, and also not of Norse/Viking origin. Changing either Astrid to Ástríđr and Halfsansdottir to Hálfdanardóttir are each minor changes. Changing Lothian to a dated, period form may be a minor change (to change from English to Norse or Irish is a major change). Rather than pass it with so many minor changes, return at this stage saves the submitter time and allows her to determine which form she prefers.
    In particular, I used the following sources to determine the proper Norse spellings of Astrid and Halfdansdottir: Geirr Bassi's The Old Norse Name, Nordiskt runnamnslexikon (http://www.dal.lu.se/runlex/index.htm, given names only in PDF http://www.dal.lu.se/runlex/pdf/lexikon.pdf) (The Dictionary of Norse Runic Names), and "Viking Names found in the Landnámabók" by Aryanhwy merch Catmael (http://www.ellipsis.cx/~liana/names/landnamabok.html). These are all acceptable and good sources for Norse names. All of them give the forms Ástríđr and Hálfdan. The rules for forming patronymic names in The Old Norse Name on page 17 specifically state that the proper formation would be Hálfdanardóttir.
    The situation with "of Lothian" is slightly more complex. In the Annals of Ulster, the placename modernly referred to as Lothian is referenced in 848 AD in "righ Laithlinne" (King of Laithlinne), in 854 in "righ Laithlinde" (King of Laithlinde), and in a ninth-century poem, "I do not fear the coursing of a quiet sea / by the fierce warriors of Lothlend". Further, in Black's Surnames of Scotland, on page 439, under the header Lothian, the earliest spelling given is dated to 1327 in one John de Loudonia and does not date the spelling 'Lothian' any earlier than 1665 (which is after our period). However, some commenters were able to suggest fully Norse names which would indicate origin/location in Scotland.
    Cleasby and Vigfusson's An Icelandic-English Dictionary (2nd ed.) (http://www.ling.upenn.edu/~kurisuto/germanic/oi_cleasbyvigfusson_about.html) gives the following useful words and descriptors: on page 555 under the header Skotar are Skotland "Scotland" and Skotzkr "Scottish"; on page 333 under the header Kati (a 'kati' is a type of small ship nicknamed a 'cat') are Katanes "Caithness" (in northern Scotland, where the Norse held sway, from 'kati' and 'nes') and Katneskr "person from Caithness". These could lead to the following names:
    Ástríđr Skotzka Hálfdanardóttir
    meaning "Astrid the Scot, daughter of Halfdan"
    Ástríđr á Skotlandi Hálfdanardóttir
    meaning "Astrid of Scotland, daughter of Halfdan"
    Ástríđr Katneska Hálfdanardóttir
    meaning "Astrid the woman from Caithness, daughter of Halfdan"
    Ástríđr í Katanesi Hálfdanardóttir
    meaning "Astrid of Caithness, daughter of Halfdan"
    Any of these would be much more authentic Norse and indicate origin or current location in Scotland or a specific part of Scotland.
    This device is returned for multiple conflicts. All cats, lions, and other felines are considered to be in the same class, when counting conflicts. Additionally, since the Norse sun cross is small enough to be maintained, it does not count for any difference (if the cross were nearly/equally as large as the cat, it would be sustained, and would count for difference). Against the arms of Belgium (Sable, a lion rampant Or) and the Palatinate of the Rhine (Sable, a lion rampart Or crowned gules) there is only one clear difference given, for adding the bordure. Against Kian hrafn af Durnesi (Azure, a lion rampant Or, tail nowed, dexter forearm armored argent, maintainign a seax proper, a bordure embattled argent), there is only one clear difference given, for changing the field. Against Maximilian Alois von Brandenberg (Sable, a lion rampant and a bordure embattled Or ermined gules) there is only one clear difference given, for changing the tincture of the bordure.
  2. Elisant le Chevaler. New Device. Purpure, a horse rampant and on a chief embattled argent, three orchids sable.
    This is being returned for for both reproducibility issues and conflict. First, it conflicts with the device of Luzia do Valongo, Purpure, a horse salient and a chief embattled argent, with only one clear difference for adding the charges on the chief. There is no difference given between salient (leaping) and rampant. Additionally, as noted in the February 1991 LoAR in the return of Megan Maria Griffinstar's device:
    ...Orchids come in far too many different shapes for reproducibility of the emblazon from the blazon, or for the blazon to adequately describe the emblazon.
  3. Natasha Mechislav. New Primary Name.
    Prior precedent indicates that documenting Natasha from Withycombe, as the local herald suggests, is not sufficient. The precedent in question is in the registration of Arianna de Chateaumichel, in April 2002:
    "[Submitted as Arianne de Chateaumichel] ... Withycombe (p. 31 s.n. Ariadne) lists Ariane as a French form of the Greek name Ariadne. When Withycombe is discussing names in languages other than English, she is usually discussing modern forms. Therefore, the citation in Withycombe is not evidence of use of Ariane as a French name in period. As the submitter allows any changes, we have changed the given name to the Italian form Arianna in order to register this name."
    The form Natasha does not appear in Paul Wickenden of Thanet's Dictionary of Period Russian Names (http://www.sca.org/heraldry/paul/). The forms which are found there are Natal'ia (dated to 1371) and Nataliia (dated to 1459-69) (both in section n.html), and both are described as a " Russianization of Natalie". Mechislav is found in the same source (in section ma.html), and it would be made into a patronymic byname (for a woman) by adding -ova, to make Mechislavova. Sound was listed as an important consideration, and this would noticibly change the sound of both name elements.
  4. Canton of Ravenhurst. New Primary Name and New Device. Sable, a pale between two laurel wreaths, on a chief triangular Or a raven rising displayed proper.
    This name is returned for the lack of both documentation and a petition. Please see the Administrative Handbook (http://www.sca.org/heraldry/laurel/admin.html), particularly section IV.C.2. Documentation, which says:
    Documenting evidence must be included for all name elements and any non-standard armorial elements or practices. Such documentation must include references to specific pages and/or entries in the source material. Except for documentation from items in Appendix H (the No-Photocopy List), such documentation must include copies of cited source material.
    Please also see the Administrative Handbook (http://www.sca.org/heraldry/laurel/admin.html), particularly section IV.C.5. Evidence of Support, which says:
    Submissions involving the branch name or arms of an active branch must include evidence of support for the action on the part of a majority of the active members of the branch. In the case of branches with no ruling noble, this support may be demonstrated by a petition of a majority of the populace and officers or by a petition of the seneschal and at least three-quarters of the other local officers. In the case of branches with ruling nobles, such petitions must also include a statement of support from the ruling noble. A valid petition must include a clear description of the item submitted; either the blazon or emblazon is sufficient for a petition regarding branch arms, though both are preferable.
    I would note that, most likely due to the administrative reasons requiring return, no one provided any commentary or support for this name, and therefore I make no comments on the name itself.
    This device is returned for the lack of a petition, lack of an acceptable name, and for issues with the emblazon. Please see the Administrative Handbook (http://www.sca.org/heraldry/laurel/admin.html), particularly section IV.C.5. Evidence of Support, which says:
    Submissions involving the branch name or arms of an active branch must include evidence of support for the action on the part of a majority of the active members of the branch. In the case of branches with no ruling noble, this support may be demonstrated by a petition of a majority of the populace and officers or by a petition of the seneschal and at least three-quarters of the other local officers. In the case of branches with ruling nobles, such petitions must also include a statement of support from the ruling noble. A valid petition must include a clear description of the item submitted; either the blazon or emblazon is sufficient for a petition regarding branch arms, though both are preferable.
    Additionally, this device has some other issues, which should also be addressed before resubmitting. Either it uses a field division/charge which doesn't actually exist, or it has two charged gussets. In the first case, the triangular yellow portion at the top is none of: per chevron inverted, chausse, a pile, nor a chief triangular. If the diagonal lines are continued to where the would meet, they meet at approximately the fess point. This is too low for a chief triangular, too high and issuant from the wrong place for a pile, too high for chausse, and too high and not steep enough and issuant from the wrong place for per chevron inverted. I would refer you to "Chevrons (inverted), Chaussés, Piles, and Chiefs Triangular, Oh My!" (http://rampart.outlandsheralds.org/lessons/blurring1.html) for a visual depiction of these. If none of those divisions/charges are reasonable to apply to this emblazon, the other possible blazon is "Or, on each of two gussets sable, a laurel wreath Or, and in chief a raven displayed sable". However, charged gussets have been disallowed by prior precedent:
    Gores, Gussets, and Tierces (Oh, my!)
    Based on the consensus of those commenting on this issue, the College will ban the use of charged gores and charged gussets, matching the ban on charged tierces. Uncharged gores, gussets, and tierces will continue to be registrable. Any charged gores or gussets currently pending at Laurel will be processed as having been "in the pipeline" before the ban went into effect. Therefore, after March 1, 1992, we will no longer register charged gores or gussets.
    Cover Letter for the December 1991 LoAR
  5. Slaine inghean Ui Sheanain. Resubmission - Kingdom Primary Name. Argent chaussé sable, a thistle vert.
    Unfortunately, this must be returned due to multiple conflicts. It conflicts with Scotland ((Fieldless) A thistle proper) and Megan of Thistledowns (Barry azure and argent, counterchanged per saltire, a Scotch thistle slipped and leaved proper). In both cases, there is only one clear difference (CD) for the different field (or lack thereof). A thistle proper (or slipped and leaved) is primarily green, with only the tuft being purple, which is too small to count for difference. If this is considered as "Sable, on a pile inverted argent, a thistle vert", it conflicts with Laurencia des Jardins (Sable, on a pile inverted argent, a foxglove purpure slipped and leaved vert), with only one clear difference (CD) for the changes to the charge on the pile inverted.
  6. Thyra, vina Ulfs. Resubmission - Laurel Primary Name and Resubmission - Laurel Device. Per pale vert and sable, a wolf statant argent and a chief embattled Or.
    As mentioned previously, both by Laurel and by Rampart, the Old Norse form of the given name would be ţyri. This time, the documentation supports the form "Thira", not Thyra. However, this is not the main reason for return. The argument for this form of the byname rests strongly on the translation in several literary works (sagas in this case) of the phrase "[Given name], [other given name]'s friend", specifically as a part of [Given name]'s full name. However, commentary indicates that this construction is actually a literary convention putting the name in context (in the way that we might, when relating an anecdote, specify which Steve was involved by saying "Steve, my sister's boyfriend") and not part of a byname. Additionally, Academy of St. Gabriel Report 2814 (http://www.s-gabriel.org/2814) discusses vina/vinr in Old Norse bynames, and specifically says:
    "In particular, we haven't found [vina] 'female friend' or even the more common [vinr] 'friend' as a byname or an element of a byname
    However, Laurel recently registered the name Thorin bjarnkarl (July 2004 via Æthelmearc), which was intended to mean either "friend to bears" or "Bjarn's friend", and at least partially based on the known Old Norse descriptive byname barnakarl "friend to children". This would indicate that some form similar to "ulfrkarl" meaning either "friend to wolves" or "Ulfr's friend" could also be plausible and registrable. I would suggest, if pursuing this path, carefully reading the March 2004 Letter of Intent from Æthelmearc, to follow their argument closely.
    As the name is returned, so is the device. Also, there is a possible conflict with the device of Gabriel Rene Antoine du Renard, Azure, a fox passant argent grasping in its sinister forepaw a hunting horn, bell to sinister, and a chief embattled Or. There is one clear difference for the field. There may be one clear difference for the hunting horn, depending on how large it is. Gabriel's device was registered in 1981, and blazons from that time often did not clearly indicate how large such charges were. If it is large enough to be considered sustained (meaning, nearly as large as the fox), there is a clear difference for removing it in Thyra's device, but if it is small enough that it is maintained, there is no difference and the devices conflict. Unfortunately, there is little way to tell, other than sending it up to Laurel so that Laurel can check directly against Gabriel's file.
  7. Wulfhramn St. James. New Primary Name and New Device. Sable, an eye argent irised azure surmounted by a sword inverted Or.
    This name is returned primarily because no documentation was provided for the byname. Even if this is his legal last name (as the form would indicate), documentation of this needs to be provided (copy of birth certificate, copy of drivers license, etc.). Additionally, Laurel has consistently ruled for SCA group names that the scribal abbreviation "St." is not registrable and consistently replaced it with "Saint". However, I am only aware of Laurel making such rulings on SCA group names, and am not currently aware of any such rulings relevant to individual names.
    The sword is really quite small. However, without a name, this device cannot be sent up to Laurel. I would suggest, when resubmitting, to draw the sword slightly larger.

Line Emblazon Sheet
Color Emblazon Sheet
November 2004 Letter of Presentation
December 2004 Letter of Response
December 2004 Letter of Intent
April 2005 LoAR Results
Return to the Rampart home page.